Welcome to Day One of FanstRAvaganza3! You're currently in the Freeform tagteam chain and I'm happy to be kicking this week off with my sidewinders ChrisB at AIsForArmitage and FaboLaktuko at White Rose: Sincere And Simple Thoughts.
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Whether you think Lucas North is a character gone wrong due to ridiculous writing choices or was meant to be John Bateman from the beginning and that arc was the most brilliant in [spooks] ten-year run (there has to be at least one person who thinks that, right?) one thing we can agree on is that boyfriend was a little, um, loose (unlike his jeans) . Flirtatious? Okay, look, this post was nearly titled "Lucas Lays London" but that's cheesy even for me.
Don't we want our broken heroes to have One True Love? Guy had Marian, after all...okay, maybe that's a bad example. Um, Mulder had Scully? That one works. The trouble with Lucas/John, though, is that t/he/y had Two True Loves, one for each personality and that's not even counting Sarah "My Favorite President Is Alexander Hamilton" Caulfield.
SPOILERS AHEAD IF YOU HAVEN'T SEEN [SPOOKS] SO BE FOREWARNED
Whoever wrote the original One True Love story about Elizabeta did an outstanding job: the thought of his ex-wife helps Lucas get through eight years of brutal torture and confinement; on his release he discovers that she moved on with a family of her own and worse she's his handler as a double agent. He's forced to choose between the woman he's loved for at least a decade and the country that betrayed him and that he still feels left him to rot. Seriously? It was brilliant and Richard Armitage and Paloma Baeza both knocked it out of the park. Their interactions felt authentic.
So what were the writers thinking when Sarah "Sam Adams Was Our Best President" Caulfield happened the following season? "Broken Lucas needs love" or "Richard Armitage needs to take his shirt off"? Maybe "We really need to justify the ridiculous amount we spent on those tat transfers"? I did a lot of, uh, research for this post and I think what bothers me is this look right here.
He does goofy in love really well. I want to buy it but I just don't. It's too something -- rushed, maybe? Or not enough something -- real, maybe? Their whole relationship really did look to me to be two really pretty people naked rather than two broken birds finding refuge (or even just one broken bird and one snake).
And then there was Maya. See, the thing with great One True Love storylines is that you only get one (unless you're Brooke Logan on The Bold and the Beautiful). It's capitalized and everything. And how, exactly, does that timeline jive with Elizabeta? Oh well, the writers ignored anatomy with their table romp, it's possible they ignored the time and space continuum, too. I didn't buy that one, either, and I had no problem with Laila Rouass (I know some of you did). They were just beating a dead horse at that point. What do you think? Who was Lucas's true love? Comments are open.
Don't we want our broken heroes to have One True Love? Guy had Marian, after all...okay, maybe that's a bad example. Um, Mulder had Scully? That one works. The trouble with Lucas/John, though, is that t/he/y had Two True Loves, one for each personality and that's not even counting Sarah "My Favorite President Is Alexander Hamilton" Caulfield.
SPOILERS AHEAD IF YOU HAVEN'T SEEN [SPOOKS] SO BE FOREWARNED
Whoever wrote the original One True Love story about Elizabeta did an outstanding job: the thought of his ex-wife helps Lucas get through eight years of brutal torture and confinement; on his release he discovers that she moved on with a family of her own and worse she's his handler as a double agent. He's forced to choose between the woman he's loved for at least a decade and the country that betrayed him and that he still feels left him to rot. Seriously? It was brilliant and Richard Armitage and Paloma Baeza both knocked it out of the park. Their interactions felt authentic.
So what were the writers thinking when Sarah "Sam Adams Was Our Best President" Caulfield happened the following season? "Broken Lucas needs love" or "Richard Armitage needs to take his shirt off"? Maybe "We really need to justify the ridiculous amount we spent on those tat transfers"? I did a lot of, uh, research for this post and I think what bothers me is this look right here.
Screencap courtesy of RichardArmitageNet.com |
And then there was Maya. See, the thing with great One True Love storylines is that you only get one (unless you're Brooke Logan on The Bold and the Beautiful). It's capitalized and everything. And how, exactly, does that timeline jive with Elizabeta? Oh well, the writers ignored anatomy with their table romp, it's possible they ignored the time and space continuum, too. I didn't buy that one, either, and I had no problem with Laila Rouass (I know some of you did). They were just beating a dead horse at that point. What do you think? Who was Lucas's true love? Comments are open.
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For more Freeform posts during FanstRAvaganza3 be sure to check out my sidewinders today, ChrisB at AIsForArmitage and FaboLaktuko at White Rose: Sincere and Simple Thoughts. Don't forget to check back tomorrow to read what Melanie at Melanie's Musings, Rose Gisborne at An Obsessed Fanatic and Itsjsforme at Do I Have A Blog? have to say.
I never, NEVER want to dissuade writers from sticking RA in romp scenes! The SarahCaulfield love story was as weak as my abs, but it was worth going through the torment of having to watch her character, just to see Lucas rolling in the sack! I'm so happy that you went the extra mile researching this aspect of Lucas- that's very thorough of you! Bet you had to watch and rewatch all of those Lucas romp scenes!Thanks for taking one for the team ;)
ReplyDeleteWonderful post!!!
Oh, don't get me wrong, if RA romping is essential to the plot I'm all for it. But plot is important, right? That's why they get paid the bug bucks. Wait, it's the BBC, maybe not, but you know what I mean.
DeleteYou're so spot on with this one J! I thought Sarah C was awful & couldn't be more wrong for our lovely Lucas. No wonder she did what she did! And Maya???? The only explanation I have for Lucas never even giving her a mention in all these years is that he must have had severe PTSD or a bit of shrapnel in the head from that bomb blast! The maths don't add up at all. I'm with iwanttobeapinup though on congratulating you on your thorough research. An excellent piece of work :-)
ReplyDeleteLOL, thanks!
Deleteyeah, the abandonment of the Elizaveta thing so easily was a big mistake. Paloma Baeza had a lot of audience approval and Armitage had great charisma with her. I mean, they strung out Adam's affairs over entire seasons, so why not have her recur and constantly cause him problems? It is puzzling.
ReplyDeleteAgree that any reason to have the man take off his clothes, however, is something I can at least partially get behind.
Yes, it was strange. I wonder if the actress had another committment.
DeleteI couldn't understand his love for either Sarah or Maya. After the wonderful interaction between Lucas and Elizaveta, both of those relationships struck me as a poor replacement for the real thing. My suspicions lean towards the writers having to find a way to get RA to take his clothes off. Don't get me wrong shirtless, RA is high on the list of things I like, but seriously...give the guy a better script if your going to make him take his clothes off!
ReplyDeleteKurbiss, I wish they had listened to you! Elizaveta as part of the ongoing plot would have worked wonderfully.
Exactly.
DeleteLove your post. I think both the Sarah and Maya story - especially the Maya story - were not well thought out by the writers. Why do the MI-5 agent with the CIA agent love story again, they did already for Tom Quinn. And I still haven't forgiven the writers for John Bateman.
ReplyDeleteI think you make the perfect case that Elizaveta was the true love of Lucas' life, otherwise why would he think of her all the years he was in Russian prison. I think there were ways the writer could have continued with that story. They seemed to reinvent Lucas with every season.
That's really well put, Fabo, and you're right. It's like the writers were never quite sure what to do with him.
DeleteLOL that they ignored anatomy. I have made a little study of that photo of Lucas and Maya on the table from Spooks 9. Yes it was quite fantastical. I wonder why it landed on the cutting room floor? I guess the BBC doesn't care about us at all. ;)
ReplyDeleteThey surely don't, B. Care to share that study?
DeleteI loved the Elizaveta story and I wish they had expanded on that, rather than invent other lovers. I wanted to know how they met for a start. By Series 8, it seemed she never existed.
ReplyDeleteYeah, she was a really intriguing character and they were really well matched. It was odd how she just kind of went away.
DeleteGreat piece, Jazzy!
ReplyDeletePun intended! Ha!
Elizaveta was a storyline where they could have had Lucas save her son's life and then find out later it was his son--from his sperm frozen before he left. Then Lucas and Elizaveta could have had a reunion shag.
And I completely agree with you about Sarah. Eck! So diphthongy and she couldn't get her US History right.
I have only seen clips of S9, so I haven't seen the full Maya table shag attempt. But I'll say it one more time, there is only one thing that should be hard in a love scene or lovemaking--and it's not the furniture. Ha!
Cheers! Grati (after dark)
LOL! I can't possibly follow anything you said there, Grati (after dark), you minx...
DeleteI can't bring myself to write about the Maya thing. The writers' premise might have been OK, but they just didn't make the transitions. And the actress was not too good here. Elisabeta (Paloma) was lovely. Writers have not done a great job with Armitage women, do you think? (I don't even want to get into SB)
ReplyDeletefitzg
Writers have not done a great job with him, either, at times.
DeleteI view the different seasons of Spooks as alternate universes, separate and distinct, because they certainly don't make sense otherwise. So I watch 7 for the angst -- love the scenes with Elizaveta, 8 for some of the side characters and Ros and the new home secretary, and 9 for Vaughn and Ruth. I watch season 7 the most. Skinny, emotionally tortured Lucas really appeals to me. I liked the scenes where you wonder if he's a double agent.
ReplyDeleteYes, MaybeDoubleAgent Lucas is awesome. They seemed to not know what to do with him after that was resolved.
DeleteThat was fun!
ReplyDeleteAna Cris
Thanks, Ana!
DeleteI really couldn't stand any of Lucas' women they were all in my opinion badly written. It was of the reasons that I had an AU character in my fanfic. Lucas deserved a strong female partner.
ReplyDeleteThank you for a great piece jazzbaby
Kate aka khandy
I think the thing that worked with Elizabeta was that she was as mysterious as he was but I see your point of view.
Deletejazzbaby - I was so glad to see you tackle this very important topic - The Love Life of Lucas North.
ReplyDeleteHaving a great regard for RA's animal magnetism, I felt that the casting directors really fell down when they selected his women.
IMO NONE OF THEM WERE SWOON-WORTHY. In Series 8, when Lucas leaned against the wall and started to 'give the look that only Margaret Hale should have' to that Sarah witch I jumped out of my seat screaming: Nooooo Don't even mention Maya - if that was a come-back performance, why not find another career.
Some actors have agents, some have publicists, what RA needs is a panel of specialized fans to select his 'love interests' What do you think?
Loved this post!
LOL, thanks! I'd have to think about a panel...like who might be on this panel?
Deleteme! pick me!
Delete@Kurbiss, LOL!
DeleteIn my analysis of Lucas, I trust Richard's own analysis. Who more than him had to be convinced of what he was saying and doing as Lucas North in the 3 series of Spooks he worked in?
ReplyDeleteHe found explanations for all the absurd, unexpected twists, the scriptwriters came to present him with.
He was convinced that John Bateman was deeply attracted and in love with Maya, but then had to forget and remove her in order to become Lucas North. He was convinced he was in love with Elizabeta and thought of her in the 8 years in a Russian prison to survive. I don't think he ever loved Sarah. Maybe he was attracted to her, but I can't see love between those two (such bad acting on her part!)
Finally, when he has to come to terms with the idea that he can't be Lucas any longer, he has found Maya again and longs for going back to his life with her before the terrible things he did. But he is losing control on his feelings, his emotions, his life meanwhile and, especially, he has totally lost his contact with reality.
I hated Spooks writer for what they did of my favourite character, but appreciated Richard's efforts in making Lucas's downfall credible. He did his best.
There was an interview that David Duchovny did a long time ago where he talked about how people would argue with him about plot points saying, "Mulder would never do that" and he'd answer them that of course Mulder would do that because it was in the script. I think RA did the best he could with what he had to work with but I think the writers were a little flummoxed with Lucas so they depended on "have him take his shirt off, that'll stun them into silence while we figure this out" too much.
DeleteROTFLOL!Jazzbaby, it's regular stupor. ;)
DeleteThank you for this post!:)
LOL, you're welcome, Joanna!
Delete@ Maria Grazia
DeleteSounds like a character with Borderline Personality Disorder, LOL.
What a great subject! I agree that Elizavieta was the best love interest for Lucas, because both characters displayed so much emotion. And I believed that he'd loved her and thought only of her while he was in prison.
ReplyDeleteEven though I didn't much like Sarah Caulfield and thought her relationship with Lucas was empty, I could imagine that maybe he just needed a physical relationship for a while--there was a moment when he said he hadn't been able to feel anything for so long. I could see that.
But Maya. Oh, no. Nothing against Laila--I just don't think she was given much to work with. Maya was a MacGuffin, a plot device, a prize that the other characters want. Bad writers! Bad! Oh, well.
I think maybe I'm too American to really get Lucas and Sarah. Like I need it spelled out in Neon foot high letters.
Deletei agree with you Jazzy, how does "Maya - one true love" timeline work in with that of Elizavieta's...i did some math... 15 years ago, Maya one true love... then Bates becomes Lucas one year later, or...how long was he in wherever he was when he killed the real Lucas? ... lets says Lucas meets Elizavieta immediately afterwards ... then he becomes this awesome awesome spy and also falls in love and marries Elizavieta, that was how long back?, lets give him 3 years time for doing both? then he goes to Russia and gets locked up pining for Eliza for 8 years ... so 15 minus 1 minus 3 minus 8- that leaves us 3 ... 3 years to forget Lucas's true love and totally go nuts over Bates's true love???
ReplyDeleteSo what were the writers thinking when Sarah "Sam Adams Was Our Best President" Caulfield happened the following season?
ReplyDeletebtw, i love that line :)
Seriously, the timeline was driving me crazy. I'm glad I wasn't alone in that, lol! And thanks!
DeleteGreat subject jazzbaby1. Have to agree with your analysis of all three women however one thing does strike me as having being missed. Elizabeta's character was well suited to Lucas S7 character as a tortured soul, but I'm not sure how I would have felt if her background had been revealed and/or the relationship taken any further. The mystery she added to Lucas's own background plot worked well and I fear that any further explanation of this or development of a love life would have lead the writers down a mundane course with nowhere constructive to go except her death. Although I do agree that she seemed to disappear too quickly. I think she should have been used in another way, to keep Lucas as a tortured soul maybe? Or maybe it was right that she went when she did. Maggie (@magwi68)
ReplyDeleteI think maybe you should have been a writer, Maggie...
DeleteI just can't forgot, that Richard was talking about steamy scene on the kitchen table, and we saw only photos :(
DeleteI never saw the photos! can you please point me to any online photos of these cut scenes?
DeleteThe problem I had with Elizaveta was that she had moved on. Prior to Lucas being taken as a prisoner she's no idea what he did. They were already at least seperated if not divorced. Also she wasn't a spy for the FSB so why would she ever become a handler for Lucas. Surely it isn't something you can just do.
ReplyDeleteLucas for me needed a woman who was his equal in everyway strong intelligent independent. A character like Ros but not Ros.
I kept waiting for the reason she was working for them to be fleshed out. That was the other frustrating thing, the writers would drop these clues and then they'd go nowhere.
DeleteIn my book, Elizaveta was Lucas' One True Love. SC (I can't even type her name in full, that's how much I detest her) was a big mistake while it could have been a good storyline: two spies trying to make it work together, never sure of whether the other is sincere or after information. But they got it wrong, it was weak and it did not do Lucas much good in terms of his credibility as a brilliant spy.
ReplyDeleteSame for Maya. It could have been a great storyline, a brilliant road to destruction for a man who gets confused between this person that he's been trying to be for the last 15 years and the person he really is. But they ignored the Elizaveta story and that made this one so very unbelievable. I tried to get over it while watching series 9, but something in the back of my mind kept saying "this is not right"...
Exactly.
DeleteI found the writing of his character offensive. An offense to my intelligence.
DeleteThe real chemistry was between him and Elizabeta. Now that was a story worth telling. Even the Maya history had potential. But noooo, the writers had to go the insanity route- theirs. I guess that for me, there is not that much to analyse. I think you delineated the issues well. What else is there to say apart from venting a lot of annoyance at those soulless freaks, the writers, who took a page out of Faust for their aspirations?
pi, you need to stay right where you are so I can aim this lasso...I agree with you. They seemed to just not really know what to do with him after a while.
Deletepi, maybe the Spooks Season 8 writers were also the Robin Hood Season 3 writers... that would explain everything!
DeleteHi, jazzbaby! Great post and I love your blog! I'm a newbie here, as with other blogs this week, so thank goodness for F3! I agreed with everything you said in your post about our dear Lucas (I refuse to refer to him as John- still in denial) and his non-realistic loves. You hit the nail on the head. :)
ReplyDeleteThanks for stopping by, Nat!
DeleteI love this post. You are right to question the sense of the storyline. The actress who played Elizaveta was the best of them all and that's why she and Lucas had more chemistry. I don't think she was necessarily his "true" love though. He pined for her in prison much like anyone would crave something which was withheld from us. Sarah C. was just someone to playact with although he did get caught a bit too deep just because he was so needy. I don't think Maya could have been such a true love either no matter how much he wanted her to be.
ReplyDeleteBut did any of the characters on Spooks have a romantic life that worked?
Somehow I CDoart in the flurry of activity but to answer your question phylly my phriend, no, none of the characters on Spooks had a functiontal romantic life.
DeleteFor a spy, after Spooks 9, I am not even sure if Elizaveta was Lucas North's true love or she was the one with whom he wanted to make all sides, the Russians as well as the MI5, believe his version of the story.
ReplyDeleteAfter all, I have no problem with the multitude of love stories.
Elizaveta, a good cover and alibi,
Sarah Caulfield, two spies trying to get the better of each other, good to watch their tricking each other, though Lucas comes out a bit weak, after Sarah does the big world conspiracy deal without him realizing it.
Maya, an old flame, maybe, maybe not. After all those years, she just adds to let Lucas North seem weak, as he did not try to do something about his love for all those years. So Maya is the last sign to show, that Lucas North is neither a good 'spy' nor a 'good' spy.
Really sad story to bring down a good role so much that it is really 'nothing' in the end.
My main objection is to the Maya/Elizabeta timeline because while it might work it would be reeeeeally close. Sarah I just didn't get.
Delete